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Timflyte

So Mike is in Fleetwood Mac ?

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6 hours ago, Jay said:

Never heard Lindsey's solo sound like refugee.

I was just commenting on the general structure of the song as performed live, not the specifics of the solo itself.

Of course Lindsey and Mike are going to play different-sounding solos, right?

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7 hours ago, Big Blue Sky said:

"Refugee" moment seems to be at about 5:00 mark (??)

All right thanks, I thought it was something they were doing 'cause Mike was in the band or he worked in the chords or whatever. It's not exactly like Refugee just sounded a bit even moreso with Mike on stage.

cheers

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9 hours ago, chimera said:

I was just commenting on the general structure of the song as performed live, not the specifics of the solo itself.

Of course Lindsey and Mike are going to play different-sounding solos, right?

...which is a good thing, right?  I mean all respect to Lindsey, but Mike's too good to do this by playing exactly like someone else. The man hasn't needed to "play covers" in that way since... oh... very early 1970s in bars & clubs?...  (Even then there's their funny story of: Here's one by Santana! & Mudcrutch would play their own originals & the crowd wouldn't even notice as their attention was elsewhere);)

 

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oh my... you may be reading this elsewhere (from article in Guardian website which I have cut down to the main points) https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/oct/12/lindsey-buckingham-sues-former-fleetwood-mac-bandmates-for-dropping-him-from-tour?CMP=twt_gu

Guitarist Lindsey Buckingham is suing his former Fleetwood Mac bandmates, accusing them of breach of contract for cutting him out of their North American tour and the millions of dollars he would have earned from it.  In a lawsuit filed on Tuesday in the Los Angeles superior court, Buckingham said the dispute stemmed from a clash between the planned 2018–19 Fleetwood Mac tour and Buckingham’s wishes to play some solo dates. The lawsuit claimed that each member of the group would have earned about US$12 million to $14 million for the 50-city tour, which started last week.

The other band members “intentionally acted to interfere with Buckingham’s relationship with [concert promoters] Live Nation and the prospective economic benefit he was to receive as a result of his participation in the tour,” the lawsuit said.

Buckingham said he learned he had been dropped two days after a Grammy MusiCares celebration in New York in January. “Less than a week after having shared a stage at MusiCares, the other members of Fleetwood Mac had suddenly cut Buckingham off entirely,” the lawsuit said.

Buckingham included in the lawsuit a copy of an email he sent to the band in February, begging the band to overcome its differences. “After 43 years and the finish line clearly in sight, it is hard to escape the conclusion that for the five of us to splinter apart now would be the wrong thing,” he wrote. “If there is a way to work this through, I believe we must try. I love you no matter what.”

 

In an interview earlier this week with Rolling Stone magazine, Buckingham blamed Nicks, his former girlfriend, for the rift, saying he was told by the band’s manager that Nicks was angry when Buckingham smirked while she was giving a speech at the January Grammy event.

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Yeah this was sure a one-two punch: first the interview with David Fricke and then the lawsuit filling.  Lindsey's side of the story confirms what I'd been hearing from various sources, but overall it's just a really sad undignified end to the Five Fireflies.

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Ouch.

Despite not really being news in any deeper sense, I am still kinda surprised by this.

Or rather, I'm surprised to find, in what surely is the same old devious bucket of.. obsequiousness (w?) with FM, that Lindsey's case probably has some merit. That is, I think he might be "right". That's the feeling I get. What's sad with this - other than making dear old Stevie look every bit the evil caricature, that some long since made her - is that Mike is now caught up in this mess too. I wonder how his contract looks, if he is free to leave after the tour, or if Stevie/FM now own his *ss? I wonder if he entered this enterprise on his own whim and from Stevie's persuation campaign only, or if he consulted Tony or someone with regards to the fine prints.    

 

3 hours ago, Big Blue Sky said:

each member of the group would have earned about US$12 million to $14 million for the 50-city tour

Yeah, you know,I really feel bad for this generation of ageing old rock stars, must say. In these modern times, when record deals and sales hardly pay their rent no more, and they only earn "US$12 million to $14 million" per tour. What an outrage. Is that all we can do for these wonderful people to be able to live off their art? Really? No wonder they are forced to work so hard and tour so much. Sucks to be them. We should all be asamed of ourselves for allowing this to happen.  

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70 year olds fighting and bickering and carrying on..."I didn't like the way he smirked at me!!" Grow up! The inner culture of Fleetwood Mac has been toxic for as long as I can remember. What a shame. 40 years down the road, and still this. Good luck with that, Mike!

Maybe this is what happens when it becomes more about the Business (capital "B") than the music....I don't know.

I'm glad that Tom and the Heartbreakers never had this type of drama play out, or this type of toxic atmosphere within their group. The closest thing they had to that was the friction/falling out with Stan...which is still a bummer to this day. Because we're STILL talking about it here on this forum. Could you imagine if a fracture happened between Tom and Mike, the way that things have went down with Stevie and Lindsey? How tragic would that be. The HB in general seemed to love and appreciate one another. You do have to give it to bands who travel together for 30, 40, 50 years. It ain't easy and smooth sailing. But what a journey and experience and bond at the end of the day. I saw it even more with Mudcrutch, that love they had for one another.

Life's too short to be feuding with fellow band mates and to not be speaking with one another. And there are so many bands that do this. CCR. Pink Floyd. The Kinks. Oasis. Simon and Garfunkel. The Beach Boys. The Smashing Pumpkins. STP. GNR (I know, I know). What you created together was special. Recognize that, remember that, appreciate that. See it for the GIFT that it is. The music is gonna live beyond you anyway...

I think bands with extreme longevity reach that point where it becomes something much greater. Something beyond themselves. It turns into something almost sacred, that you're entrusted with, something in your care, that means SO MUCH to so many people. How cool to achieve that? TPATH had it for sure. Tom used a words like "holy" to describe what the Heartbreakers did, and what rock and roll felt and meant to him. And I believe that. IT IS something sacred, and they were so fortunate to be in that position for so long.

And the fans? That's just icing on the cake for you. Music creates so much JOY for people. Those who get to make it, and those who get to experience it.

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The fact that they chose to play "Free Fallin'" should tell you everything you need to know about the current Fleetwood Mac. They want to honor TP? Fine. They could have chosen dozens of more appropriate songs. Mike Campbell wasn't all that excited about performing "Free Fallin" night after night before TP died. He specially told the other members of FM that he was uncomfortable with that song and didn't want to do it on this tour. His new bandmates could have honored his request and showed him respect by instead letting him pick a song. They could have performed a song that he cowrote, like "You Wreck Me" or "Runnin' Down a Dream." (Neil Finn, after all, is allowed two spots for songs he wrote in the setlist.) They could have simply selected a different Heartbreakers song like "I Need to Know" or "Stop Draggin My Heart Around."

But instead they went for the easiest, most obvious choice, the one that would garner the most adulation, even over the objections of the only guy in the room who actually has a claim on the song. I really wish Mike would have stood his ground on this one and been firmer in asking the band to go a different direction. But then again, I really wish he just politely declined their invitation to join the band in the first place. It just never felt right. And now Lindsey is suing the band. What a circus.

I think Mike is getting a firsthand lesson on how less dignified, more superficial operations than TPATH operate.

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9 hours ago, RedfordCowboy said:

What you created together was special. Recognize that, remember that, appreciate that. See it for the GIFT that it is. The music is gonna live beyond you anyway...

I think Chris Cornell or Kim Thayil called being in a band a five way marriage. Or someone did, but it makes sense. Not easy between fame, drugs, women, money, and wild egos to survive, let alone be close and dignified. From all accounts it seems like Tom did the best he could as a leader and in the end, there was a drummer change and a bass change and then back to the original bassist. Over 40 years; it's impressive.

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3 hours ago, High Grass Dog said:

Mike Campbell wasn't all that excited about performing "Free Fallin" night after night before TP died. He specially told the other members of FM that he was uncomfortable with that song and didn't want to do it on this tour. His new bandmates could have honored his request and showed him respect by instead letting him pick a song.

Wow! I agree. Don't saddle the man with the song he has to now play every night as a tribute to Tom. The Dirty Knobs tribute had such wild energy and emotion, again, Free Fallin' just feels very generic.

 

3 hours ago, High Grass Dog said:

I think Mike is getting a firsthand lesson on how less dignified, more superficial operations than TPATH operate.

Yes. I'm sure he knew while inside the band how special his situation was compared to other "horror stories" he may have heard about other bands; but something different to be a part of it, even at a far remove regarding the lawsuit.

Good points.

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18 hours ago, chimera said:

but overall it's just a really sad undignified

 Yes it is sad, I agree and I wouldn't even be posting on this if not for Mike being a part of the band.

15 hours ago, Shelter said:

Yeah, you know,I really feel bad for this generation of ageing old rock stars, must say. In these modern times, when record deals and sales hardly pay their rent no more, and they only earn "US$12 million to $14 million" per tour. What an outrage.

It's pretty crazy. I figure it takes quite a disciplined grounded person to not go cuckoo over vast sums of money when one is already rich.

15 hours ago, Shelter said:

is that Mike is now caught up in this mess too. I wonder how his contract looks, if he is free to leave after the tour

I figure he's going to be a gentleman and honor his commitment to this tour and then he'll go back to his own band. However if he wants out he'll walk after, contract or no. Are they going to sue him to or force some kind of penalty for breach of contract? I figure Mike wouldn't give a damn.

But like I said, based on interviews and such and reputation and his own style of playing the man conducts himself in a tasteful way in the public eye and I figure he'll put his head down and play through this tour, Free Fallin' and all and will really savor playing smaller clubs with the Dirty Knobs and be excited to have their first album out.

cheers

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18 minutes ago, MaryJanes2ndLastDance said:

 How much dignity can you have in the first place if you're known as the Five Fireflies?

Ha-ha, but it's just a term fans started using based on a song Stevie wrote about the band called "Fireflies."  

Some call it our nightmare
My five fireflies
Oh like a sailing ship...
But not one of us runs..

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The part that shocked me was reading that a) there doesn't seem to have been a specific issue and that b) they didn't at least try to mediate an ending via lawyers / professionals that was more or less okay with everyone & c) friends refused to take his calls / respond to e-mails. 

:( I don't know the legal position, but if we consider Fleetwood Mac as a business for a moment, then imagine a company edging out a long-established partner in this way.  What? Hey man, you're no longer working with us at the bakery as of today.   No particular reason, we don't want to talk about it  & we've changed the locks to the shop & warehouse.  

Still, there are always helpful lyrics somewhere - may I suggest the immortal  Better Get a A Lawyer as growled out by The Cruel Sea? 

Then the officer said
Better get a lawyer, son
You better get a real good one
Get yourself a suit and tie
And get your hair cut way up high
Get yourself a lawyer, son
You're gonna need a real good one...
 

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