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tarquin

When are we going to get some stuff ?

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So I understand the period of mourning & not wishing to cash in on Tom’s passing, but when are we going to get some stuff ?

the blu rays of Mojo & DTT are changing hands on eBay for fortunes, could do with a re release & we all assume All The Rest is just waiting for someone to press return on a keyboard somewhere.

David Bowie himself seemed to initiate his postimous releases with a furious burst of activity just before his demise.

I certainly wouldn’t feel ripped off if some nicely packaged posthumous or retrospective stuff came out.

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3 hours ago, tarquin said:

So I understand the period of mourning & not wishing to cash in on Tom’s passing, but when are we going to get some stuff ?

the blu rays of Mojo & DTT are changing hands on eBay for fortunes, could do with a re release & we all assume All The Rest is just waiting for someone to press return on a keyboard somewhere.

David Bowie himself seemed to initiate his postimous releases with a furious burst of activity just before his demise.

I certainly wouldn’t feel ripped off if some nicely packaged posthumous or retrospective stuff came out.

Well, Bowie knew that he was dying, and, assuming that TP didn't know what was going to happen, he/they hadn't planned for that. I imagine that it's a big shock for everyone and that it might take a while to decide how to handle this new situation and what the best thing to do might be.

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I don't see anything happening soon. Just because there is material that can be released, it takes a lot of time (sometimes years) to mix tapes to studio quality for release to the public. Then you need the band there to work together on each track, get a producer, engineers and so on. Just because there is a tape or video, that doesn't mean it's ready for release. After 40 years of perfection, I don't think the band will rush release anything until it's perfect.

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But "all the rest" has to be seriously close to ready for release by now?  I mean they were saying its coming soon for a couple of years now....   Obviously the untimely passing of Tom puts things in a holding pattern but I have to think it would be out by the end of the year at the latest??? 

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The thing about this band is that, at times it felt more like a family than a band. They worked hard but their feeling together has always been a very important, integral part of who they were as a band. So now they are grieving, literally more like a family and friends than a business unit and I bet until they are over the worst of it, we won't see anything. And I would not wanna rush them. That's my 2 cents.

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Fans would love to be able to buy some Tom Petty things.  It's been 6 months since his passing and not any books, dvds, BluRays... nothing.  How about some reprints of "Conversations with Tom Petty" or "Running Down a Dream" coffee table book?  Some of us never saw or bought the book and would like to buy it now.   When other singers/entertainers have passed away, many things were put out on him/her within days/weeks of the passing.   I hope that in the coming days/weeks, more Tom Petty things can be available to fans who would really like to enjoy buying items of his.   I'd love to see some live concert DVDs or Blu Rays of "Take The Highway", "Pack Up the Plantation", "Winterland" and so many other fabulous concerts.   They can even put out DVDs of his various interviews and parts of different concerts.  At this point, anything would be welcome on Tom Petty.   For me, he is a "legend" and his passing should have generated a high volume of his work to be sold in stores.

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2 hours ago, twisterseal said:

his passing should have generated a high volume of his work to be sold in stores.

Him being alive is what should have generated sales and popularity! And so it did. 

Sorry, but death as a marketing tool is f-ng ugly, if you excuse my language. Other artist's management may be trigger happy to reprint and market anything within "days/weeks", but one of the main reasons I loved Tom Petty in the first place is that his management won't. I hope that doesn't change now when Tom's own controlling hand is gone. Reading your post make me wish they will take even longer to release anything.

As for "All The Rest", it's been ready and waiting and even marketed since my granda was a young boys, so that one could really be released already, I agree that process has been ridiculous (even if I really understand a certain on-hold type of reasoning for the last few months). As for everything else, I say it's good that they just don't hurry to flood the market with all kinds of ugly stuff just cash in on death and on people being pathetic, loving and respecting dead artists over living ones. Seriously. Some respect. Some dignity. 

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I respect your opinion and sorry if you took my post wrong...  Is there any objection to at least reprinting things that have not been available for a long time?  Like the books "Conversations with Petty" or the coffee table book "Running Down a Dream"?  Some of us hadn't bought that and would like to buy it now.....as well as DVDs of some of his concerts such as Take the Highway.     Since Tom originally authorized those things, I see no reason to not put them out again for people to buy.     Perhaps any new things will take a while - but I think it would be nice to reprint some of the things that were out of print for many years.    Those books on Amazon are selling for "over the top" prices and I'm sure Tom would not be happy with those high prices as he is one of the few artists who really cared about his fans and making his concerts, books, DVDs, CDs, affordable for everyone.  He once said he didn't want to just appeal to the "elite" and from that day on, I loved him.  Actually I've loved his music since the late '70's.   Anyway, I'm new to this forum, but I'll limit my posting.  This forum is a great place though...and really enjoyed reading the different topics and news...and I think the photo thread is the greatest.  

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8 hours ago, twisterseal said:

I respect your opinion and sorry if you took my post wrong...  Is there any objection to at least reprinting things that have not been available for a long time?  Like the books "Conversations with Petty" or the coffee table book "Running Down a Dream"?  Some of us hadn't bought that and would like to buy it now.....as well as DVDs of some of his concerts such as Take the Highway.     Since Tom originally authorized those things, I see no reason to not put them out again for people to buy.     Perhaps any new things will take a while - but I think it would be nice to reprint some of the things that were out of print for many years.    Those books on Amazon are selling for "over the top" prices and I'm sure Tom would not be happy with those high prices as he is one of the few artists who really cared about his fans and making his concerts, books, DVDs, CDs, affordable for everyone.  He once said he didn't want to just appeal to the "elite" and from that day on, I loved him.  Actually I've loved his music since the late '70's.   Anyway, I'm new to this forum, but I'll limit my posting.  This forum is a great place though...and really enjoyed reading the different topics and news...and I think the photo thread is the greatest.  

 

No need to limit your posting. Everyone's entitled to their opinion :) But I am one of those who thinks that right now is not the time to focus on new releases. I'm sure there'll something at some point - maybe later in the year, maybe next year... - but to be honest, I'm not even interested in new releases right now. I just think it's such a shame that he's no longer here, and personally, I'm glad they're not rushing things out, but taking time to grieve, regroup and think things through (or maybe not thinking about it at all at the moment),

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13 hours ago, twisterseal said:

 Anyway, I'm new to this forum, but I'll limit my posting.  This forum is a great place though...and really enjoyed reading the different topics and news...and I think the photo thread is the greatest.  

By all means, don't limit yourself. All opinions are fine and more than welcome. 

And no, I have no objections as far as releasing old OR new stuff goes. (The whole issue of what and how people here think "stuff" will be made available, has been discussed in other threads, and I don't think anyone suggest that there should be a stop to releases.)

No, my only concern is the hurry. I may be wrong in finding the view in your post, that just cause others have been profiting in a gross way from the death of artists, within "days/week" as you say, the people dealing with Tom's business should do the same. Sorry, if that was not more or less what you said. Myself I find that type of behaviour - standard procedure as it might be these days - to be morally wicked and appalling. Hence my voicing of a different opinion. I also very much find the partying all the way to the bank atop someone's grave to be very counter to anything that Tom was about, as far as his morals go. 

All in good time, is all I'm saying. I don't wanna see any memorial issues being rushed, is all. 

As you were.

:)

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1 hour ago, Shelter said:

By all means, don't limit yourself. All opinions are fine and more than welcome. 

And no, I have no objections as far as releasing old OR new stuff goes. (The whole issue of what and how people here think "stuff" will be made available, has been discussed in other threads, and I don't think anyone suggest that there should be a stop to releases.)

No, my only concern is the hurry. I may be wrong in finding the view in your post, that just cause others have been profiting in a gross way from the death of artists, within "days/week" as you say, the people dealing with Tom's business should do the same. Sorry, if that was not more or less what you said. Myself I find that type of behaviour - standard procedure as it might be these days - to be morally wicked and appalling. Hence my voicing of a different opinion. I also very much find the partying all the way to the bank atop someone's grave to be very counter to anything that Tom was about, as far as his morals go. 

All in good time, is all I'm saying. I don't wanna see any memorial issues being rushed, is all. 

As you were.

:)

'As you were.'  

Have you been following Liam Gallagher on Twitter lately? :)

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I know he holds a special place in everyone’s heart here, but feel if they leave it too long, the wider public will just think “They have released something from that bloke who died a while back, he had a few hits in the 90s, didn’t he ?”

Do they even know what album “Room at the Top” was on ?

I don’t necessarily see these re-releases as just cashing in, but also saving a musical legacy.

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^ There is a certain charm to that, admittedly. 

Still, I'm not sure I'm following... (Sorry, man, it might just be me misreading you here.. Although I really prefer to think of it as a very literal way of of reading what people say, rather than trying to guess their good intentions, of which I'm sure you have many. I just try to face what I read here, if perhaps in a disturbingly honest way. Sorry if that's the case.) See, even if I am not at all as much in a hurry, many of us seem to want kinda the same thing. To me though, it's more a matter of how it gets done and that they take their time to proceed in a respectful way, true to the name and methods of Tom, that they release fully worthy things that, more or less would have been released anyway, so to speak... than them rushing things out just cause Tom's death is so fresh on people's minds, that he's still fairly hot, as the market lingo has it.. (Jesus, why am I even writing things like that..!). Frankly, I couldn't care less about people with a minimal attention span anyway.. as far as that goes.

And following the discussion to precisely that aspect, I must say that what seemed like the initial plea made - for people who previously missed out on getting some of Tom's stuff (for various reasons), now when he's dead suddenly want it real bad (for equally various reasons, I am sure) and therefor should have said stuff asap - really is a MUCH better one (save for that dollars changing hands over caskets aspect, I mentioned, if things get rushed or done the wrong way), than this new idea here. Releasing stuff in order to keep infidels aware of Tom Petty?* Kinda of like a missionary approach? As if releasing stuff is supposed to fill some kinda vague cultural heritage obligation? A general good for generations to come, that Warner Brothers just have to put a milker on, I have to suppose?** 

Either way, your post serves to remind me, how thin the line can be between answering to a demand and creating one. Not that one is better than the other. But one is.

 

 

-----

* This is to devil's-advocating stuff a bit, I know. For the TP brand, it is obviously crucial not to lose it's luring power. That is the market logic you are touching upon in your post, surely. "The way things works!". (Ok, well..) But again, I like to see Tom at least a little bit as an exception to this "rule", that business takes priority nr uno over the artistic vision and output at a very distant second. Artistic production as a somewhat necessary mean to serve a greater financial good, with some fresh input from time to time, to keep things interesting. (As opposed to the other way around, where at times profit is a  great and lucky side effect to great art - and where artistic vision rules all, somewhat naively, but hello...) This, my friend, is why so many dead artists - I suppose - are in such a hurry to keep putting all these gold lined things and memorial this and that out. It's because they have long sinced stopped being an artist first and formost and instead they have become this huge business empire that runs accoring to its own logic, with you being the both the customer and the sucker. Sure some of them still was great artist when they passed away, but in those cases the machine they'd created around their brand long sinced had outgrown them, sidestepped them and taking on their own life and logic. Some big business didn't even learn how to exploit things properly until so many years after the face on the shirt went to the heavens, that it was practically like inventing a whole new career, only without the hassle of having to deal with an actual living guy. (Man, I really don't have to tell you all this, do I?)  --- Anyway. To all this, I see - I really want to see this!! - Tom Petty as a sound exception. A man of some type of dignity and sanity, that at least on the surface of it all, seemed able to combine being hugely popular, selling great numbers and still fly above at least some 90% of the bullshit aspects and ripping his fans off and other going-ons on the so call market. (Even if certain aspects of the HCC club in recent years was a borderline case of losing control and willingly inviting the "dark side", so to speak). The business side of show business always was one nasty bugger. A murky and sickening place where perfectly great geniuses have been known to be chewed to pieces and spit out as all kinds of nameless plastic. And - this speaks for the audiences as well - a dead artist always was all the more profitable to exploit than a living one. People really DO want more releases when an artist dies, it seems. You are so right that way. It's the same old life-as-an-afterthough, I suppose. A very human thing, on the face of it. Personally I am glad if "Tom Petty", now when Tom Petty is gone, can stay well above all this muck, that his management has the manners to treat his legacy with dignity, to put out well made stuff, reissue, what people seem to want the most and most of all that they won't engage in too much image-building, legacy building excercises that Tom himself would not have liked. After all - his work spoke for him all his life and so I hope it will continue to do. This, again, may be splitting hair to what you are about, but it seems to me to be one or two main differences between our perspectives worth pondering.

** I guess the discussion of how many future generations of relatives and shareholders, should be able to gain from one person's work, really is an interesting one, that applies somewhat, but really deserves its own discussion. Many contributors here - most of all the very much alive and very much wonderful Heartbreakers - of course deserve to get their earnings for the work the done on various levels, and that, my friend, is another, and even better argument for WB to release more stuff, when the time comes! Yes! You can have that one, if you want some more good stuff to back up your case! :)   

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To those who think it is a scandal that something should be released to cash in on Tom's death.

Cue heavy response.......

Bear in mind Tom Petty (or those who ran things for him) were not adverse to the odd rip off.

Highway Companions Club charged $50 for dubious benefits, such as the early ticket access and the odd bonus track, and the other method to hear exclusive tracks was often the subscription radio network.....

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10 hours ago, tarquin said:

feel if they leave it too long, the wider public will just think “They have released something from that bloke who died a while back, he had a few hits in the 90s, didn’t he ?”

 His songs are perpetually played on classic rock, some are in movies, between Greatest Hits, Full Moon Fever, Damn the Torpedoes and Wildflowers I think people will be purchasing and listening to the albums for a long time. They've been pretty much playing roughly the same set for years and still having big enthusiastic crowds show up, so I don't think Tom is in any danger of being a Forgotten Man. Couldn't resist using that!

cheers

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14 hours ago, tarquin said:

To those who think it is a scandal that something should be released to cash in on Tom's death.

Guess I deserved that.

 

14 hours ago, tarquin said:

Highway Companions Club charged $50 for dubious benefits, such as the early ticket access and the odd bonus track, and the other method to hear exclusive tracks was often the subscription radio network.....

True that. To the dismay of fellow fans (who hold Tom's morals in almost religious esteem, but still seem to be curiously missing from this discussion on ethics), I've been pointing this out myself, many times. Dubious indeed. Very un-Petty like behaviour that. And there are more examples too. Still. Compare it to the rest of the mad circus and I think you find a decent operation on most levels.

And, needless to say - perhaps my main point here, if it still fails to hit home - as bad as a rip-off always is, one that is being served in someone else's name, when that person is dead or otherwise void of control, is arguably much worse. Being it  a much more multilevel offence.* 

And since there still seem to be doubt and confusion (and when is it not), I like to repeat myself, to say again that this, to me, is not a question about if things should be released. I like to have all I can in terms of what they feel like sharing from the vaults. Don't be mistaken.

No. It's about how and to some extent when. And perhaps most of all I reacted to the way some people here seem to argue, the reasons they/you put forth in defence of the management swiftly releasing stuff - being it that "others do it all the time", or "to save Tom's heritage" or implied "do it while it's still a good market" are all very odd, not to say dull arguments to me. I am sorry. They are all the wrong reasons (pun).

 

-----

* I suppose what happened to HCC, could be attributed to Tom's lack of interest, thus control, in all computer things. And with the result being less charming, it may be just another proof of what happens when the middle man gets to run free. Big mistake. That goes to say, that I hope, despite this proof of the opposite and some related worries, that it's now the respect for Tom's views that will prevail, not the few mishaps in the past, being them due to lack of judgement or lack of control. That the management will resist the urge to go nuts now when Tom's gone. God knows there are no guarantees.... and the arguments put forth by you guys may well soon get the trigger finger of the managemet to pull.. "My God, Tony! The Kurt Cobain industry had a glorious ten years at least!" "I heard they still do alright for themselves." Ok, then. Pull! 

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20 hours ago, Shelter said:

But again, I like to see Tom at least a little bit as an exception to this "rule", that business takes priority nr uno over the artistic vision and output at a very distant second. Artistic production as a somewhat necessary mean to serve a greater financial good, with some fresh input from time to time, to keep things interesting. (As opposed to the other way around, where at times profit is a  great and lucky side effect to great art - and where artistic vision rules all, somewhat naively, but hello...) This, my friend, is why so many dead artists - I suppose - are in such a hurry to keep putting all these gold lined things and memorial this and that out. It's because they have long since stopped being an artist first and formost and instead they have become this huge business empire that runs accoring to its own logic, with you being the both the customer and the sucker. Sure some of them still was great artist when they passed away, but in those cases the machine they'd created around their brand long since had outgrown them, sidestepped them and taking on their own life and logic.  

Love how well you expressed what I was thinking but was unable to put in words with such a flair :) I would go a step further and just say that I would like to see not just Tom but his whole band (of introverts) as the ones that did not let the business machine outgrow their artistic vision, and stay consistent to what they have always been. That's why I think, let them grieve. Who can think of putting out stuff when they first try to get over the death of someone they loved? First that personal relationship. Then, art. Then, public. I guess my argument for that is also not very good, as it simply just makes me love this band :D 

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^ Thank you kindly. It's all a futile resistence, if ever I saw one... 

18 minutes ago, limonali said:

the ones that did not let the business machine outgrow their artistic vision, and stay consistent to what they have always been. 

Well, wouldn't that be nice. Unfortunately, it's a little too late for that, hu. Once the "rights" and "licences" are fully or partially signed over, or in other ways ends up in the hands of the wrong people - especially business side specialists, with a strikingly different agenda from the artist, usually - it's more or less game over, as far as intact integrity goes. Sure, these things are never black or white, but I'd say that any band/operation as big and successfull as was TPATH, sooner or later will be forced to involve certain powers from the outside, that may to a varying degree handle things differently than the artist/band would've wished for or themselves found optimal. It's just bulit in logic that you can't stay 100% indipendent when you get big enough. Things need to work logistically, and that's where shit starts to leak in... Obviously these risks gets bigger ones the main guy is gone.

That said, my previous rants all serve to express a wish for any such damage to be as limited as possible in the case of Tom, rather than being cheered for by hungry fans in for a quick fix. (Perhaps the remaining members of the band will push for fair and honest handeling of the legacy, to the extent that they have a say so - at least MC is bound to have some, thanks to songwriting and production creds). After all, there is no such thing as uncorrupted rock'n'roll, but with a legacy and history of integrity like Tom's, there should be good hope that at least the most commonly used rip-offs,  the most standard soul-less crap routines,  the most shallow exploitations and hurried decisions, will be largely avoided even by his hired hands. Amen.

As for issueing music, I may add that I personally think that any release of "new" stuff, that was prepared and ready to be released anyway (example: "All The Rest"), would be fine about this point. That type of this-is-what-I-had-ready type of releases are usually a lot more fair and honest, as I see it, more like a closing type of continuation (of that makes sense) than any memorial reissue or now-I'm-dead-now-I'm-hot-here's-my hits-again type of rehashed retrospect. After all, I am sure there will be plenty of time for all of us to buy, not only numerous reissues of all Tom's work, but also all kinds of official and unofficial "Free Fallin'" parachutes and "Even The Losers" poker sets. As much as I hate it, I could live with a certain Kiss:ness in the world. I just hope that as long as something is gonna have Tom's name or face on it, it won't pop up in my face within months of his passing, is all. It really rubs me the wrong way. I might be a bit old fashioned that way. 

Besides. Who would want to buy an unofficial parachute anyway?!

 

 

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I have not read every reply but wanted to insert my 'two cents'

Seems a sick thing to want possessions because someone has passed. Take it from me, after Michael Jackson and David Bowie died all the sudden instant sycophants were stumbling over themselves to get their hands on everything associated with the artist, from coloring books to locks of real hair.

Sick. You want more Tom? You should enjoy what you have, what is out there now. Who needs commemorative items, or tell-all magazine articles, books and film?

I'm not trying to sound snarky or rude, it's just I feel these baubles only represent people's animal greed for competition, for being better 'fans' than everyone else because they spent hundreds of thousands on rare tribute items.

Had to vent ...

 

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Wow, that's not a very good impression of "not trying to sound snarky or rude"....

& No, you didn't read the posts, wasn't asking for locks of hair or the like.

Currently we have items that have already been released, but are in short supply such as the Mojo Blu Ray, changing hands for fortunes on Ebay etc, by people presumably cashing in on a dead artist, but a re-release of that or the All The Rest album which we have been led to believe is ready to go, are well overdue, even before Tom's sad parting.

So if anything was ever released again, as I say even including the stuff that is already ready, then that is a sad cash in ?

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