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Coroner's Report/Petty Family Update

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4 minutes ago, nobodyinparticular said:

I don't think he was addicted either. Could've been something as simply as accidentally double-dosing. It's easy enough to do. Severe pain really impairs your judgement.

I know.  All you want to do is get rid of it by any means possible.

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4 hours ago, nobodyinparticular said:

I don't think he was addicted either. Could've been something as simply as accidentally double-dosing. It's easy enough to do. Severe pain really impairs your judgement.

Exactly. Even without memory problems, pain can easily cloud your thinking. And even without pain, I am sure I often accidentally take my probiotic twice. 
My other pills are in an organizer, but even then, it's easy to forget them and vice versa.  

 

 

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1 hour ago, Liberty said:

Exactly. Even without memory problems, pain can easily cloud your thinking. And even without pain, I am sure I often accidentally take my probiotic twice. 
My other pills are in an organizer, but even then, it's easy to forget them and vice versa.  

 

 

I once ended up in the hospital after an accidental quadruple-dose. Two similar-looking medications with vastly different doses. 

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On ‎21‎.‎01‎.‎2018 at 10:27 PM, Nel said:

Well, I'm not gonna play doctor. But I will  repeat a very common medical fact regarding joint problems, as well as osteoporosis; AGE plays a major role bone health. Tom's autopsy didn't include any information on whether or not he had osteoporosis,  If it did, then I missed that.  We have known, since his death, that Tom fractured his hip shortly before the tour was to begin.  I know some fans think that postponing the tour in order to  repair or replace Tom's hip would not have made any difference. That is, some people think Tom would have died on October 2 either way!  

I don't feel that way at all. I know what horrific joint paint feels like. I choose to deal it without  painkillers. But then, I'm not a musician performing lengthy tour. Tom lived with both, knee pain and a fractured hip. He obviously was in debilitating pain.  Now, my opinion isjust my opinion. But I think that IF Tom had postponed the tour and had surgery to repair his hip, he would not have needed high doses of pain meds.  I don't think his medical issues were so severe that they could not have been treated. Personally, and this is just my observation, I think the overuse of pain meds killed our beloved Tom.  Not his medical problems. 

(Sorry for this discombobulated post^. But I couldn't make any corrections for some reason. )  

I also was to add that I don't think Tom had a drug problem. I just think his pain was too much and he seems to have relied too much on pain meds....obviously overdosing. 

I see it the same way. Even speculated along those lines in another thread (

) way before the results of the coroner's Report became known.

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I've started and deleted a number of posts in this thread.  I think in the end, all I can say is I will always love his music and wish we had more to share from him. Too young and too soon for this.

Truly a tragedy but we can't change what has already happened, so life must go on.  

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On 1/20/2018 at 7:29 AM, Lifeshouldbesung said:

It's such a shame. I wonder - not that it's any of my business and not pointing fingers - if anyone close to him tried to talk him out of touring. That last video of him the week before he died (going to the doctor) was sad to watch and that alone would have made me raise questions about him going on stage a few days later. I just hope it wasn't a case of, like so many other famous stars before him, him being 'enabled' because so many people depended on him financially. I feel for his daughters and band members especially - all those years with this man they clearly all adored, and then, it's all over. I agree with Shelter that the tour was unnecessary and should have been cancelled/postponed. What's the fun in playing injured anyway? Is it really worth it? Anyone who wishes him well would have understood if he cancelled because of health reasons. Either way, it's a very sad and seemingly unnecessary way to go. And yes, I agree, he probably wasn't selfish enough and possibly too concerned with pleasing others. Oh well, as the cliche goes, at least we have his music and today I shall be listening to Wildflowers :(

I am split on this too. Did nobody say anything? When you get to the level Tom is I doubt few people are willing to say "no." In this case zero people.

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My dad had emphysema.  He was diagnosed at age 49...retired at 51.  He had whooping cough as a child , worked with asbestos and smoked.  ( A habit he got when he was in the army in WW2, the cigarette s were provided free ).  He died at 66.   At the time of his death prostate cancer was found ,but with his health condition , surgery was not possible.   How Tom managed to sing is beyond me.  My dad's shortness of breath prevented him from doing much.  He had to take medicine 3 times a day toward the end . A breathing machine.  Plus oxygen.  Just last week I took oxycodone....at work , one pill for the pain in my legs from my car accident.   The drug stopped the pain but made my stomach so upset and my head so loopy I had to go home.   How Tom could function with pain meds is beyond me.  I feel for him.  His pain must've been unbelievable.  I too wonder why no one said , get well first .it's almost like Elvis , no one would step forward in fear of getting the boot.  It reminds me of Tom's song " it's good to be king ".   He had to be in unbelievable pain. 

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10 hours ago, Timflyte said:

My dad had emphysema.  He was diagnosed at age 49...retired at 51.  He had whooping cough as a child , worked with asbestos and smoked.  ( A habit he got when he was in the army in WW2, the cigarette s were provided free ).  He died at 66.   At the time of his death prostate cancer was found ,but with his health condition , surgery was not possible.   How Tom managed to sing is beyond me.  My dad's shortness of breath prevented him from doing much.  He had to take medicine 3 times a day toward the end . A breathing machine.  Plus oxygen.  Just last week I took oxycodone....at work , one pill for the pain in my legs from my car accident.   The drug stopped the pain but made my stomach so upset and my head so loopy I had to go home.   How Tom could function with pain meds is beyond me.  I feel for him.  His pain must've been unbelievable.  I too wonder why no one said , get well first .it's almost like Elvis , no one would step forward in fear of getting the boot.  It reminds me of Tom's song " it's good to be king ".   He had to be in unbelievable pain. 

A side effect of my medication is shortness of breath. I can't sing a lot of the songs that I normally could sing before the medication. 
Luckily, singing isn't my job or my livelihood. 
While I do believe Tom wanted to be out there playing music... I agree that it was probably rough and painful for him. 

---

Though, I try to look at Tom's life from my own perspective.
My health has just been getting worse over the past couple years, and if I was able to push myself and go out doing what I loved... hell yeah. That's what I'd do.

Tom's passing, in a weird way, reminds me of this ideology: Guitars are meant to be played. If I had a rare guitar, or any guitar... I would rather give it to someone I know would love to play it rather than sell it to someone who wanted to put it on display or put it in storage as an investment. Tom wanted to play music. I think Neil Young said it best: It's better to burn out than to fade away. Tom deserved twenty more years with his family, to love them, to spend time with them, and they deserved to have him around, but life doesn't always work out that way. I simply mean to say that it is best (in my eyes) he went out doing something he loved rather than being trapped in a retirement home like many people have to live through. 

*'It's better to burn out than to fade away' is actually from the last song on the album (Into the Black).
However, I prefer the acoustic opening version which has a similar line because it's more personal/intimate. 

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I'm also concerned about the concurrent usage of citalopram (Celexa, an SSRI), oxycodone, and fentanyl - the combination of those have been associated with serotonin syndrome.

It looks like there might have been some pretty bad coordination of care - perhaps his general practitioner prescribed the temazepam (Restoril), a psychiatrist prescribed the citalopram and alprazolam (Xanax), and a pain specialist prescribed the oxycodone and fentanyl. It's a pretty bad combination. (He also had acetylfentanyl in his system, which isn't licensed for medical use. I'm not going to speculate on that.)

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9 hours ago, Shelter said:

find it difficult, crippling sad and mostly pointless to speculate or pass judgement about the private, medical details in all this.

 I feel the same way.

9 hours ago, Shelter said:

What was done and how it was done was even more routine than usual (keeping in mind that Tom always was a friend of routine in his live shows). Even by his standards things seemed set in auto pilot and rather tired.

 At the time I thought it was the price of going through the motions of the same old set, tour etc. I didn't notice anything off or if I did, attributed it to the routine.

10 hours ago, Shelter said:

f he thought that he was gonna live and have more shots at doing great stuff in various ways, why then set out on such a struggle at such a cost for the artistic outcome and his personal health?

 I don't know, but there is, that's the question. I'm surprised that no one rushed Tom into surgery for his hip after the tour to get it fixed immediately. Then again, perhaps he was scheduled for some work to be done. Who knows?

 

10 hours ago, Shelter said:

In case of the latter, perhaps any tiredness and stagnation would have been credited to lack of artistic vision or energy by "tough" (some say unfair) critics like myself, but since knowing what we know now, I can't help but regret making such assumptions in the past.

 I understand why you'd feel this way but you're being too hard on yourself.  Your criticisms were fair and even-handed and if you'd known that he was out there performing with an injured hip, would have taken that into account, of course. I don't think you were tough nor unfair but were simply speaking as a fan with an intense passion for TPATH's music and the hopes they could one day translate the urge and energy to not repeat themselves on record, to the stage. Heck, you weren't even hoping they'd play what you'd want them to play, but for them to go out there and do whatever they wanted regardless of fan expectation, as long as it was genuine.

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18 hours ago, Timflyte said:

He had to take medicine 3 times a day toward the end . A breathing machine.  Plus oxygen.  Just last week I took oxycodone....at work , one pill for the pain in my legs from my car accident.   The drug stopped the pain but made my stomach so upset and my head so loopy I had to go home.   How Tom could function with pain meds is beyond me.  I feel for him.  His pain must've been unbelievable. 

 Sorry about your Dad's suffering and your pain. 

 

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I had a dream about Tom two nights ago.  The first and probably the last.

I was watching him run through an obstacle course again and again and remember thinking "Good Lord!  This man is going to kill himself."

Then, I woke up.

I wonder what about Tom's life that my subconscious translated into an obstacle course.

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ooof... Stevie Nicks:

“He should’ve canceled, and he should’ve just gone home and gone to the hospital. But not Tom. He was gonna go down that river. And so, God bless him, he finished his tour at the Hollywood Bowl. Three shows. And one week later he died — but he got down the river,” she added as she began to choke up. “So Tom, I know you’re standing next to me cause you always have been for so many years.”

http://people.com/music/steve-nicks-emotional-speech-tom-petty/

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20 minutes ago, Mudcrutch said:

ooof... Stevie Nicks:

“He should’ve canceled, and he should’ve just gone home and gone to the hospital. But not Tom. He was gonna go down that river. And so, God bless him, he finished his tour at the Hollywood Bowl. Three shows. And one week later he died — but he got down the river,” she added as she began to choke up. “So Tom, I know you’re standing next to me cause you always have been for so many years.”

http://people.com/music/steve-nicks-emotional-speech-tom-petty/

I believe her when she said her heart will never get over this.  When you get older, you just don't recover from emotional trauma and setbacks the way you did when you were young.  Stevie is pretty resilient, but this might do her in too.

 

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4 hours ago, Mudcrutch said:

ooof... Stevie Nicks:

“He should’ve canceled, and he should’ve just gone home and gone to the hospital. But not Tom. He was gonna go down that river. And so, God bless him, he finished his tour at the Hollywood Bowl. Three shows. And one week later he died — but he got down the river,” she added as she began to choke up. “So Tom, I know you’re standing next to me cause you always have been for so many years.”

http://people.com/music/steve-nicks-emotional-speech-tom-petty/

I guess we all feel like that now, about Tom putting his attention on his health, rather than the tour. Things like tours can wait, serious health problems often can't. 

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6 hours ago, Mudcrutch said:

ooof... Stevie Nicks:

“He should’ve canceled, and he should’ve just gone home and gone to the hospital. But not Tom. He was gonna go down that river. And so, God bless him, he finished his tour at the Hollywood Bowl. Three shows. And one week later he died — but he got down the river,” she added as she began to choke up. “So Tom, I know you’re standing next to me cause you always have been for so many years.”

http://people.com/music/steve-nicks-emotional-speech-tom-petty/

He went down swingin' and enjoying every minute of it. ❤️

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Here's the thing as I see it....you keep reading Tom's thinking of his fans , but I believe , 100% of his fans , would rather have no tour and a healthy Tom.  I know I would and I believe all of us here feel the same.  He obviously didn't know how much we care .  As much as his fans enjoyed the tour , to have Tom recuperating , would've made us all happier.  I think there's more to his health problems then they're saying , and that's their right for privacy.  I had a uncle who died , fairly young , early 50's, who if he didn't have the surgery he'd die , but he died during surgery.   Maybe Tom's case was like this. His emphysema may have prevented surgery , we just don't know.  

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Tom Petty’s Death: Authorities NOT Investigating Doctors Who Prescribed Lethal Rx Combo

Published January 29, 2018 at 12:10 am PST
 
EXCLUSIVE
10-06-petty.jpg

MEGA

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The agencies involved in determining how Tom Petty died are not investigating why the singer had taken a lethal combination of prescription medication, nor the doctors who prescribed them.

LAPD and the L.A. County Coroner’s office both tell The Blast that no investigation has been launched to determine why Petty was prescribed several medications which, if taken together, could have deadly consequences.

Sources tied to the case tell us that during the course of the coroner’s death investigation, a “home visit” was never conducted to gather evidence on all of Petty’s medications because he officially passed away at UCLA Medical Center after being transported from his house in Malibu.

Had Petty died at home, investigators would have gathered all relevant evidence, including prescription bottles and information about the doctors. However, this was never done and the L.A County Coroner officially closed its case, listing the death as accidental.

According to the autopsy report, Petty had a lethal combination of oxycodone, temazepam, alprazolam, citalopram, acetyl fentanyl and despropionyl fentanyl in his body.

We are told that the coroner’s investigators determined the acetyl fentanyl could have possibly been an illegal street version of the powerful opioid. It is unclear, based on the lack of evidence, if Petty ingested this designer version of the drug or if it was a metabolite of the fentanyl patch he was wearing.

However, officials are not interested in opening an investigation to determine how Petty may have obtained an illegal version of fentanyl. A spokesperson for the LAPD tells The Blast, “We have not received any information that detectives are investigating into how Mr. Petty obtained any drug.”

Illegal drugs are also not the main issue because, as addiction specialist Dr. Drew Pinsky tells us,“The doctors are the ones who should be held accountable,” adding, “It is very hard to overdose from just prescribed fentanyl patches, but it is very easy to overdose if taken together with benzodiazepines.”

A toxicology test showed Petty had Xanax — a benzodiazepine — in his system.

In a statement, the Petty family told fans, “On the day he died he was informed his hip had graduated to a full on break and it is our feeling that the pain was simply unbearable and was the cause for his over use of medication.”

Dr. Drew says, “Any doctor with proper training in this area would NEVER prescribe these two drugs together, especially to an ex-heroin addict.” Petty had openly discussed his history of drug abuse.

We are told investigators have received several calls from fans of the “Free Fallin'” singer questioning why authorities haven’t gone after the doctors who gave him the medications.

Unfortunately, Petty’s family would have to submit evidence of over-prescribing or information that his doctors had done something illegal for officials, including the Medical Board to get involved.

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There's just too much unknown about what happened. Something about this feels off but it could just be attributed to the puzzling way people behave, not always in their best interests.  I'm amazed that Tom was able to perform with an injured hip and even give an interview shortly before his death. 

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What's done is done.  All the speculation in the world isn't going to bring Tom back.  We'll never know why Tom did or didn't do what he did or didn't do.  I just feel sorry for his family who have to learn to live with the loss of him.  It's not easy.

Having said that, I still would like to know how he injured his hip.  Does anyone here know?

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18 minutes ago, Lorra said:

.

Having said that, I still would like to know how he injured his hip.  Does anyone here know?

 

I was curious, too. But we'll likely never know. 

 

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