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  2. Yes, preaching to the choir here, but a certain variety seems to me to be quite the corner stone of what an album is, or should be, right? At least in order to be succesful. Very few artists and albums go far if all their songs are the same or in the same style, beat, groove, mood to a too large degree. Wouldn't you say. Further, if Tom was more varied than other great album artists is debatable. I guess there are a few arguments that he was and a few that he really wasn't. I think he knew how to build a record, an album, with a certain "arch" of moods and flows to it. For the most part, as we've talked about elsewere, he was a master at this art, as I see it. He knew how to create dynamics with a groove or a change in tempo or a sligth difference in beat. Of course. All great artists and all great albums have that. That said - I think Tom operated mainly in one main classic rock field, with a rather limited number of sub-styles, and perhaps one or two more unusual efforts over the course of his 45 years with Mudcrutch & Heartbreakers. He visited and revisited the same general area of the map almost exlusively*, even if he was aware of the outside world of course (that he ocassionaly had influences from other people than Elvis, Beatles and JJ Cale too.) Other than a change in drum/rhytm preferenses and a slight mellowing out on average, leaning towards more mature themes lyrically perhaps - all of which follow a development curve of sorts - it's not like his music changed that dramatically in core character or genre, though. Not that he peppered his albums with different styles. Not really. Not like he tried that many radically different or wild and experimental styles or genres** He had a diverse understanding and great passion for the rock tradition (as did his band) and you can generally tell as much - no need to stick to Anything That's Rockn'roll on every song or every album, when you have the talent of Tom Petty. So to speak. After all, Tom worked great wonders within his field, in terms of how he tweeked stuff, developed them, how he had a very unique and oftentimes fresh way with words, and how he produced and arranged his songs to quite a few different flavors over the years. I don't think he ever stagnated. But I don't think he changed his game that much either, or was that incredibly ecclectic really. It's more like he kept exploring the core he loved and knew. And I for one loved most nuances of what came out. I know we've touched upon this before, it's the same old radical-change-at-core or not discussion, the same old stoner issue perhaps or the same question of whether or not TPATH were ever psycedelic or experimental. Either way. It's my take that yes, of course their records were varied to a degree. That's what great albums are. That a similar type of blend can be traced throughout the cataloge - as per your arguments - seems, ironically enough, to confirm my view that midst all the variation in Tom's music creativity, a core musical identity stayed much the same over time. Also the frequent use of "Ain't", "Don't" and "Won't" incidentally. Defiance at core? Well.. ----- *Sweet William vs Burned Out Town, Yer So Bad vs Big Weekend, For Real vs No More...... just for the sake of the argument. This is not a problem to me. This is art. **Other than very none-experimental and none-wild dabbling with Ska or Reggea moods for a few songs (You Don't Care, Don't Pull Me Over), or cutting what to me seem more like a joke-turned-studio-product-turned-groovy-hit-under-the-influence-of-cocaine-Dave-Stewart (DCAHNM), implementing Las Vegas sentiments or delicate jazz swagger (It Ain't Nothing To Me or Full Grown Boy), unusual pulsating minimalist spook sensations (Peace in LA or Looking For Daddy) he was rarely THAT far out there. I'd say he stuck pretty well to the punch rock, the jangly groove and mellow introspects mentioned. (Especially the latter allows for leaning towards a few traditional pillars within the wider rock tradition in which he worked - as in "blues", "country", "southern", "stoner" type of spicing - without becoming overly adventurous at that, or unusually diverse, doesn't it. To me it seem only natural, really.) It's a simplified trinity, I get it. But it makes sense and I agree with what you say about Tom's music at large being categorized by the three of them. But again.. those three modes, or tempers, hardly makes him THAT incredibly diverse compared to his peers, is all I'm saying.
  3. It is one of the most important songs of the album. Room at the top, Echo, One more night... Devastating songs, they put you down... But Rhino Skin is just like, hey, I'm down but I have elephant balls to keep running through this world.
  4. Interesting angle. I guess you are right. It just strikes me that FMF has no less than 4 big single hits and at least one or two crowd favorites. Which is, arguebly, a lot for one single album to carry. Perhaps even a few songs too many for your average Anthology Compiler to bypass and start digging for more stuff. This is also why so many of their songs never got played live. They had what they needed to fill the 18 slots, basically. I wouldn't judge anything based on this though, or on any sort of anhologies. But that's me. Yes, what with the electric guitars right? It's not Megadeth, but I see what you're saying. And Red River, yeah.. funny you should mention it. That to me is no-no for the family. I like to protect them from the hellish voodoo imagery. Yeah.. I don't remember the story in detail right now, but wasn't DOF an older song that Tom found in an old notebook and took to Mudcrutch. Don't recall from what era it origined (if that's actually mentioned) but it really seems to be one of the most genially "generic" Tom Petty compositions in terms of vibe, hook and mellow catchiness, the way he started to deliver them a few years into his career. It's very much a Flirting With Time or Depending On You or Keeping Me Alive or you name it kinda song. By the book. How such a typical and catchy TP song could've been left at the side of the road for so many years is quite remarkable. And it ended up with Mudcrutch. Go figure.
  5. It is one of the most important songs of the album. Room at the top, Echo, One more night... Devastating songs, they put you down... But Rhino Skin is just like, hey, I'm down but I have elephant balls to keep running through this world.
  6. FMF is deserving of it's popularity and is a great listen, agreed. I even don't mind Face in the Crowd these days, which I thought was very dull as a young man. Nobody compiling anthologies likes it, however. In regards to Great Wide Open; It's funny, I tear up often within the first few seconds of All the wrong reasons, it's just so beautiful, but hey, that's me! Clearly somebody (other than just me) likes Accused of Love, as it ended up on "American Treasure." For me, it's a really catchy brother to the equally likable "This one's for me." I ranked Hypnotic Eye second last. but it's still got some nice songs. I don't like the opener much, I find it a tad unpleasantly heavy, and it has has the unnecessary swear word which makes it less family friendly. Fault lines is okay, and I like Red River. All you can Carry is certainly the highlight and a real return to form. None of the other up-tempo tracks are as good as "Dreams of Flying" on Mudcrutch 2 however, and none of the ballads are anywhere near as good as "Beautiful Blue," a Wildflowers/ HC hybrid triumph. "Full grown boy" is boring to me, and I can't recall "U get me high," but I do remember it being boring. I'll have to give it another listen, though . The album could still be growing on me.
  7. I should add if you like all the songwriting on ITGWO then that's a heck of a good record for you to listen to! It's got a bit of everything, tender songs, fast ones, the moody groove of It's Good To Be True and the heaviness of All or Nothin'. For me, the weaker songs drag the record down for me a bit. cheers
  8. I think that is a common perception of the record; while for me it wasn't as good as FMF I still really like it quite a bit. Returning to Drew's point about a lot of different styles or feelings to the songs, I think that really holds true with ITGWO, even with the numbers I don't care for (All The Wrong Reasons, Kings Highway, ITGWO etc.) there's a wide range of emotion to the record. All or Nothin', Makin' Some Noise and Built To Last all have such different approaches in music, tempo and feeling and are a lot of fun to listen to. It does feel of a piece. If you didn't know, I guess after hearing FMF and listening to it nonstop, Rubin wanted to work with Petty and that's why they ended up doing Wildflowers together; very simplified version. But I guess he loved FMF. For me, Echo is too long and a lot of the songs just don't connect. I think Accused of Love could be the nadir of the record and one of the worst things Tom ever wrote. Oddly enough though, when I think about it now, Rhino Skin and the line about "elephant balls" shows his stubborness and dedication to his creativity; I guess some wanted him to change it but it's an effective and funny lyric. Full Moon Fever. Just a great run of songs, perfectly placed on the record. Side A is just fantastic, it's so good but then Side B is equally good yet different. I think Mike Campbell played his best solo ever in the outro to Runnin' Down A Dream. A Face in the Crowd is moody and evocative, Zombie Zoo a carnivalesque stomp and then you've got Alright For Now, a simple, powerful lullaby right towards the end. It's one of those records you could just play front to back over and over. I feel the same about Hypnotic Eye, a really good run of songs at nearly forty years into being a band! Tom could've gone a more singer-songwriter approach, or kept with the blues or "blues" of Mojo but instead went for a rockin' album. The first three songs alone are these really good rock songs, yet each are so different, the heaviness of American Dream Plan B (yet with that amazing acoustic moment), the thrilling groove of Fault Lines and then boom! Red River, that opening sounds so heavy, yet kinda makes me feel like I'm hearing a big band play that first note/chord. I think they perfectly balanced faster moving or heavier tracks with lighter ones. The album has a couple different songs that could serve as the emotional core of the album, from All You Can Carry's defiance in the face of adversity to the celebration of the imagination in U Get Me High. The record ends on an epic song for them, from Benmont's piano intro, the heavy groove and then the optimistic finish with just Tom and a guitar. Well, anyway, those are my top two TPATH records (I just ignore that FMF is a solo album when I mention my favorite) and while I won't say it's impossible for them to be knocked down, I doubt it. I think, aside from the singles that a lot of TPATH records are a mix of filler songs (from my perspective not the band's) or weaker tracks and others that are good, but not too many albums of theirs I can listen to from beginning to end, so it's a combination of the songwriting, performances and the tracklisting. cheers
  9. I must admit to loving Jeff Lynne's production, and it's in full swing on ITGWO, glorious acoustic guitars and layered vocals floating around everywhere. And some excellent TP melodies and lyrics. I remember in my first flush of TP enthusiasm back in 2004/05, I recall buying this one and expecting a poorer man's FMF (I used to look at the reviews on allmusic.com a lot). Playing it through for the first time, I was mighty surprised and mighty delighted. You're right that Echo has an opposite feel in general, though again the melody is what counts most. Also, there's something special about the guitar sound on Echo, and all the mid-tempo/ up-tempo sounds have a crisp Rick Ruben sound but with some real energy behind it. "I don't belong" is unmistakably from the Echo sessions, and the only outtake from the recent set that I am excited about. The ballads are powerful and melodic also. Perhaps needless to say, there's so filler on either of these albums for me. Thanks for your comment, remind me of your top two?
  10. I don't know if I'd go so far as to say "best" but based on An American Treasure and even that new song tacked on at the end of the other box set, Best of Everything, I'd say there could be quite a number of good songs, hopefully across a variety of style's (as Drew noted above). Walkin' From The Fire could be my favorite of that bunch. And some time earlier they released Lookin' for Daddy which to my ears, is one of their more experimental tunes. Maybe there's some really weird stuff in the vaults, songs that will make Don't Come Around Here No More sound pretty straightforward. The band certainly seems to think so, alluding to lots of songs so I guess we'll see. cheers
  11. Wingin' it is good! You got Money Becomes King on The Last DJ, My Life/Your World on LMU, Shadow People and Full Grown Boy on HE, what else? It's a good point, maybe something that might seem obvious now but was left unsaid, maybe never really discussed on here before. A good observation to make! cheers
  12. I understood you, I just figured it was interesting that the "best o' the best" at least among the 16 voters ended up with that grouping. This could've been 16 people who favored the more mellow end of things, like HC and Echo. But yes, there is a pretty good mix which you get into below: That's a pretty good breakdown (pun intended). Though I'd maybe put FMF with the DTT bunch but really, that's a pretty good summary. Reminds me of a girl I knew, she said she cared about me...no no, that's not what she said, what she said was how TPATH covered a wide mix of musical styles, this was after watching the WF show, at night on the lawn, dancing under the stars, years and years ago. We all pretty much agreed with her. There's been finer nights since but I didn't know how good I had it at the time. I suppose one could take your perspective and map it onto the Greatest Hits, a fine mixture of jangling, hard rocking, moody, and even a dash of the psychedelic. Yes. It's neat how there's the Greatest Hits, and a few albums that are still considered classic, DTT, FMF & WF and the rest a melange of styles for the more hardcore fan to seek out. And on this forum a combination of people who have all kinds of differing taste and opinion. cheers
  13. Yesterday
  14. I thought that's what you meant, and I likewise meant that the ordering of the entire 16 is not so skewed to one or the other major types of music presented by TP/TPATH. I think I might even see 3 major types of music with TP/TPATH, for me it's the more hard rocking DTT/LAD/HE, the more mellow WF/STO/Echo, and the more jangly HP/ITGWO/HC. With maybe FMF/LMU/TPATH/YGGI straddling the line between jangly and hard rocking. Ok maybe I'm just winging It at this point; there's variety within each of the albums to some degree. Think of Mystery Man on the first album, or Louisiana Rain on DTT, or The Criminal Kind on HP, both I Should Have Known It and Something Good Coming on Mojo, etc.. But what we are both saying is that one type doesn't completely dominate the fan rankings. Which shows widespread appreciation for what TP was doing. And while not every TP/TPATH album suits my own musical taste 100%, I'm glad that so many fans can approach this music from many angles and eventually hear all that he/they had to offer.
  15. More my point was that it could've been more skewed with their more rocking albums (DTT/HE/FMF/Self-titled/) or the more mellow, depressing ones (Echo/WF/Last Dj/Mojo) but instead ended up with a mix. It seemed to have a lot of fans on here as I recall but who knows. That's an album that keeps dropping in my estimation, same with Last Dj. I see how it is. Fine, be that way, ignore 8 3/4. Yeah, makes sense. I agree about the strangeness as well, of which I think it continues on here and there even just from little things like "normal noises in here" to all out with the ITGWO stage show. There is a sense of them trying anything and having fun with the process. That's a first. I mean the energy, I don't blame you for being afraid, ranking can be a serious business. Despite the much lauded and worked for drum sounds on DTT, which I like, I also like the drums on the first two records as well, overall both album one and two sound quite good to me. cheers
  16. It's ranked there because it was the only slot left. Well, d'oh. Yes. It's the lack of professionality, basically. I've genuinely experienced the Shelter records, both in terms of material and sound, to be very "short of the book" so to speak. The result is very unusual. Intense, urgent, fresh. And at times a little strange. And quite frankly that's exactly why it's more timeless than most of the more stylish, sharp and experienced efforts out there. It's Magic that way. Energy is too sleepy a word, I'm afraid. You can tie it back to DTT, I suppose. A lot of said strange magic got lost with the demon producer. Now don't get me wrong. In time they found the blend, their very special own formula with Jimmy, as you can see on my ranking. I just don't think the first attempt is quite as stellar as official legend has it. Amazing songs for the most part though. It really is. Energy too. Switch with nr 8? Could happen, just impossible to compare...
  17. Thanks Shelter, yes I read the LMU discussions here and enjoyed them. LMU Is my 5th ranked of the 16 albums, so high praise from me. I particularly liked that many singled out Ain't Love Strange as a favorite from LMU. That's long been one of my favorite "neglected" tracks. Great song and very well played.
  18. Yes, and I think that's true when looking at the entire 16 album ranking. It seems that all the various styles are appreciated, except perhaps for Mojo's "bluesy" style. Frankly while "blues" is often critically acclaimed, and appreciated as a foundation of rock and roll, it's never been a big seller with the public. So no big surprise to see that at or near the bottom. Something had to be last anyway. I'm not sure about that. Maybe, but I'd guess that if 100 fans had voted, the final ranking order would be about the same as it is with the 16 voters. Now one way for HC to go a bit higher might be if everyone heard the "Special Edition" and if those songs were presented in a more suitable order, as we've discussed a bit (and I'll start that thread soon, to see how others would position the songs). Then again, it's currently quite far behind the 14th most popular album, so it would take a lot of very different voting just to raise it one notch. My experience with statistics says that's not so likely. Even so, I had HC at 11 myself, with the Special Edition version in mind. Along similar lines, I have Southern Accents as my 4th choice, but it's 11th in the consensus here. And I think that's unlikely to change even if a lot more fans join in voting, though I hope they do anyway. The Southern Accents album has one of the best opening tracks Rebels, one of the most creative tracks Don't Come Around Here No More, a couple of the best sentimental tracks Southern Accents and The Best of Everything, a great rocker Dogs on the Run, a memorable story-song Spike, and even a cool sax-driven song Mary's New Car - that BF Goodrich liked so much they wanted to use it in a tire commercial, then tried to steal it when TP wouldn't license it to them. Yet it's solidly in the bottom half for the TP/TPATH fan community; which shows how deep the albums are in great songs, and how deep the entire Petty catalog is in great albums.
  19. That's an interesting combination, definitely getting a whole range of emotions from the band. I think of ITGWO as largely a happy album, from the bright cover, to the chiming guitars, the fun of Makin Some Noise, Learning to Fly and the power of You and I Will Meet Again. Even Built to Last ushers the listener home on warm soft sounds. Which is a far cry from Echo, an album cover so gray and gloomy it fits the songs within. Thanks for sharin'! cheers
  20. I think if more people participate Echo will rise and STO will drop a bit.
  21. Interesting approach! A quick perusal of the top five, let's see. I guess it's not a big surprised that DTT is number one with its list of hits. No, you know what, let's try a different approach. Looking at the top 5 as a whole, it's interesting to me in that it pretty much covers the spectrum of TPATH's music. You've got the big breakthrough record filled with hits, the moodier follow up where they stretched themselves, another more rocking affair but different then DTT, WF which was another huge record and showed a big shift in Tom's songwriting and finally FMF, third of three big significant records for the band and one of uptempo fun pop-rock-n-roll. I think if more people had voted HC would be much higher up, I don't know about Mojo though. I think it's better than other albums but I'm not surprised that the one record where they really abandoned all their signature styles in favor of longer meandering guitar heavy pieces, or at least, an album dominated by such, would come in last. I think I remember on the old official board how people were upset with the record when it first was released, the long songs a big turn-off for a lot of listeners. Is DTT ranked here because of its quality or just that you've heard it and the big hits on there so much? I was surprised to see this record at this spot for you. Then again, FMF has been overplayed and is higher so perhaps it's nothing to do with overplayed songs at all. My guess is you rank You're Gonna/Self-titled so high not just because of the songwriting but the overall energy and sound quality of those records too. cheers
  22. MaryJanes2ndLastDance

    Eddie and Ric RIP

    Next to TPATH's greatest hits I think the Cars is one of the best collections of a group's songs. I've not heard much beyond those songs but I think they're fantastic. The Cars are a very unique sounding band and their mix of riff, melody and synths somehow make them feel timeless. Moving In Stereo, Dangerous Type, BFG, Good Times Roll...I've heard them for years but still think they're quite good! Just What I Needed intro is wonderfully simple and simply powerful. You Might Think is a perfect pop-rock song. Anyway, I was a bit sad to learn about his death. The Cars are a unique rock band, they don't sound like anyone else from a combination of his voice and their layered catchy music. cheers
  23. TomFest

    Eddie and Ric RIP

    Yes, sadly the hits just keep on coming. I wasn't a big Eddie Money fan, but I certainly remember him all over the radio. The Cars on the other hand were huge for me. I was just getting into electric guitar when their first album hit, and some of those were fairly easy to figure out the chords. I saw them on their first tour - still have the program. Coincidentally, I've been listening to some bootlegs of The Cars recently and watched an early performance a few days ago. Rick Ocasek had a unique voice and a unique look on stage. He didn't put on much of a stage show, but he sure could write, play, and sing. RIP, Eddie and Ric.
  24. Big Blue Sky

    Eddie and Ric RIP

    Oh, such sad news. Sorry for your loss. Thanks for sharing such poignant memories. Golly, that video where he's walking on water in the pool! (Looking more than a little like Nick Cave? No? Okay, that's just me.) I guess The Cars for me is their lovely haunting "Who's Gonna Drive You Home?" I looked up the MTV video, but, alas, I have no memories of seeing it... So the song would've been via radio. And likely to have been played over & over for years, given how well I know the lyrics. The other Cars' song in my memory is the one that's not "Jesse's Girl", but is, uh, wait, yes - "My Best Friend's Girl". (!)
  25. I've been to a number of small shows since Tom passed but nothing in a major venue. Bob Seger is coming back to Boston next month and I got tickets for that. Should be a good show as he still can bring it and I will be glad to see one of my favorite singers live for the first time at the Boston Garden where I saw Tom... I guess he plays a heartbrekers song in the music before the show starts so it should not be too bad in that regards for waterworks.
  26. Timflyte

    Sad News

    Prayers continue for you.
  27. Hoodoo Man

    Eddie and Ric RIP

    I want to acknowledge the passing of a couple amazing musicians this past weekend. Although losing Eddie Money or Ric Ocasek was not the same gut punch as losing Tom was its still a major loss to the classic rock community. Tom and Eddie were certainly friends and Eddie had some nice things to say when Tom passed away. I grew up in the 70s/80s and want to share a fond remembrance of that time with my fellow Pettyheads. I don't recall exactly how old I was when I started riding my bike to the local library but I can narrow it down to between 13-15 years old more likely the younger time point, it was about 2 miles and included a brutally steep hill getting there (and a blissfully fun hill coming back I might add) but for a few New England summers I would ride my bike to the library to borrow some records. My parents had one of those huge old console record players and I would periodically when nobody was home let that sucker blast at 11 on the dial and the thing rivaled the stereo I have now for loudness. Foreigners Juke Box Hero was a favorite, loved the Doors and Zepplin and was discovering our Tom. Eddie Money had a few albums I borrowed often Just loved to listen to Shakin at full blast and I'm sure the No Control album played a role in my tinnitus. Still have the vinyl for that one after all these years as I eventually bought myself a copy... being from Mass I was always a fan of the local music scene and loved Aerosmith, the Del Fuegos and Til Tuesday, but the Cars had a very special place in my heart and Let the Good time roll was always one of my favorites, loved damn near every song they released but towards High School they had one of their last big hits with Magic to me the way Boys of Summer defines the end of summer that song starts it. Ric and the Cars are one of the few artists that I will not only not change the dial on the radio when they come on, but I have to turn up just a little bit louder. The great gig in the sky is getting better every day and the world is a bit dimmer with the loss of each of these greats. RIP Ric and Eddie! Your music will on in my mind forever.
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